Today I had the privilege of speaking to Howard Sewell, President of Spear Marketing Group. Spear has been a strong presence at the Marketo User Summits for several years and Howard continues to offer the community his expertise in a variety of ways. If you haven’t heard of Howard, you probably have come across Spear’s free Marketo template offers and Top 10 Webinar papers. Howard probably doesn’t realize this, but he is one of the people I continue to look up to in the Marketo Community because he took the time to speak with me way back in 2010 when I had just started with Marketo. Here’s what Howard had to say about his work in the B2B marketing world.

How did you get started in marketing automation?

I’m an old-school direct marketer. I started my marketing career in direct mail back in the late 1980s at Oracle. After Oracle, I ran my own agency for 19 years – at first, focused on direct mail, and later expanding to demand generation, and clients were always asking how we could help filter, qualify, and nurture the sales leads we were generating for them. Those questions led to getting involved in marketing automation, and ultimately to joining Spear in 2010.

Tell me about your approach to client engagements.

Our most successful client engagements are those where we’re a genuine partner and not just a vendor. Much of the value we bring to the table is in the area of fresh ideas and best practices, and so we’re most successful when we’re involved from strategy to execution. As an agency, if you’re executing on someone else’s vision, you’re simply bandwidth for hire.

What’s your favorite platform?

Most of our clients run Marketo. There’s no one platform that’s right for everyone, but we really like Marketo’s functionality, the user interface, and the fact that it enables our clients to measure the true revenue impact of demand generation programs. Plus I think they’re a great company.

What’s been your favorite engagement so far?

Navicure is a small, growing software company in Atlanta – we’ve been working with them for years and they make us feel like we’re part of the team. That kind of trust and confidence allows us to do great work. For pure cool factor, we’ve done a lot of work for Google, and they’re absolutely a fun company to work with. I appreciate the way they empower their people to make decisions – it gives a marketing agency like us the ability to really push the envelope.

How many people do you have on your team?

By the time this is published, we’ll be at 30, which will mean we’ve tripled in size in a little over 3 years.

Why should people choose you?

We’re one of the only true, full-service marketing agencies that really knows its stuff when it comes to marketing automation. Most service providers in the MA space – many of whom do really great work – are basically systems consultants, whereas clients hire us more for things like lead management strategy, campaign development, and creative execution.

Which areas do you specialize in?

We’re a very specialized agency. First, 90% of our clients are B2B technology companies. Second, the work we do is generally either demand generation (e.g. feeding the funnel) or lead management. We help our clients generate, nurture, and convert leads to revenue. On a day to day basis, that means we’re designing or building everything from PPC landing pages to lead nurturing emails to large scale, global campaigns.

Do you have a Package or Pricing Summary?

We really don’t – every engagement is unique. We work on both a project (fixed fee) and retainer basis.

What kinds of firms would find you the most helpful?

If you’re a B2B technology company that needs to generate more leads, generate better leads, or do a better job converting the leads you have, we can help.

What do you do for fun?

Cooking, cycling, and watching our two kids grow up.

What’s the best way for marketers to get in touch?

Email, definitely. I don’t answer my phone! howard (at) spearmarketing.com

I’ve noticed B2B marketing leaders eschew their phones because of too many cold calls or sales calls. Understanding this behavior vs. other functions would be an interesting research project for a marketing automation firm’s content team. – Josh

And I’m back to full time consulting with Marketo and Demand Generation. Let me know if you have a project – hello [at ] marketingrockstarguides.com.

I am continuing my Marketing Automation and Demand Gen Leaders series with an interview with DemandLab founder, Rhoan Morgan. Rhoan is CEO of this boutique firm based in Philadelphia. Rhoan founded DemandLab in 2009 and has grown the firm into what I would call a full service demand generation agency. Since my first conversation with her last year, I have known this is someone to both watch and admire. Let’s learn from her today.

How did you get started in marketing automation?

I fell in love with marketing automation when we deployed Marketo in a company I worked for. Until then, we were pretty much just tossing leads over the fence to the sales department using our CRM, with zero insight into the needs and behaviors of our prospects and customers. Marketo changed everything. It was a revelation, and I knew this was where the future of marketing—and my future—was headed.

[I felt the same way when I started with Marketo – Josh]

Why did you decide to start your agency?

After working as an independent consultant with a handful of clients for about a year, I founded DemandLab so that I could give clients more complete, integrated services. This expansion brought in staff to support deployment and implementation while I could provide more focus on strategic advisory.

Also, we found that many clients deployed these great systems and then said, “Now what?” They didn’t have the fuel to power the engine: professionally designed and written content that creates brand awareness and guides prospects skillfully through the funnel. So we further expanded into offering design and content services to help our clients take their efforts to the next level.

Tell me about your approach to client engagements.

As a consultant, I learned to collaborate closely with my clients. As an agency, we follow the same approach. We do a lot of listening and learning to understand the client’s business holistically and build on the experience and expertise of their marketing team.

We also prioritize structure, because we’ve found it results in a smoother project experience and a better end result. We hired a full-time project manager this year, and we use Clarizen to keep projects on track and moving swiftly.

What’s your favorite marketing automation platform?

That’s a tough question. My “first love” and my area of greatest expertise is Marketo, but when it comes to choosing the right platform for a client we will keep options open and consider the business need of the client. Everyone’s needs are unique, which is why it’s great to have so many strong marketing automation options to choose from.

What’s been your favorite engagement so far?

It’s really hard to choose, but ultimately I’m most proud of the work that produces highest levels of return for a client or pushes the envelope with respect to what we think the technology can produce. As part of a recent Marketo deployment we also included a newsletter “makeover” that’s saving our client about $300,000 each year.

How many people do you have on your team?

We have seven people on staff, including consultants, a designer, a content strategist, and a project manager. We also team with partners when a project calls for an expertise outside of our core capabilities.

Why should people choose you?

Because we structure every engagement as a tailor made project to deliver quick wins and long-term value; and have the capabilities to jump in and create a turnkey program that can be quickly implemented. We live and breathe marketing automation, so we bring a wealth of innovation, best practices, and practical experience to every project and we pass that expertise on to our clients so that they can continue to create success within their organization.

Which areas do you specialize in?

We specialize in ensuring the optimized use of a client’s marketing automation system from pre-deployment planning to implementation, integration with other systems, and leveraging the MAP to support all marketing efforts.

A big focus is on end-to-end lead life-cycle management, helping clients map out the life cycle of a lead and move that lead through their systems efficiently, from initial touch to conversion and beyond.

Our approach is different because it takes both technology processes and people processes into consideration. People often forget the “people” part of the equation, but the system has to work for the inside sales person and everyone else who has a role to play.

We also provide content and brand development when clients need help laying the groundwork for an effective campaign. No matter how finely tuned your marketing automation system is, you won’t see results if you’re not sending excellent content and spot on messaging.

Do you have a Package or Pricing Summary?

We offer a range of packaged services, including marketing automation audits (a complete audit of your existing system and setup), marketing automation deployments, managed services, content planning and creation, positioning, persona development and consulting.

What kinds of firms would find you the most helpful?

We have a diverse clientele, but we bring particular value to:

• Value-driven companies. Because we’re very focused on optimizing ROI, we’re a good fit for companies that want to see more value from their existing system as well as those that want to make a wise investment in the technology.
• Global companies. We have experience deploying solutions for global organizations, which tend to require more process mapping and training engagements to bring disparate teams together, and accommodate different priorities and work styles.
• Smaller marketing teams. Having design and content specialists on staff allows us to deliver fully integrated marketing campaigns to companies that may not have the capacity to create new marketing assets in-house. Also, offering managed services packages mean we can keep the engine running while smaller teams focus on strategic efforts.

What do you do for fun?

Hang out with my husband and four-year-old daughter (reading, playing, and learning as much as possible). And when I want to relax I try my hand at baking a really complex dessert.  When I want to get full of energy and excited I read about and plan my ultimate productivity process (I know that is really geeky but I won’t be satisfied until life is seamless – which means I’ll be at it for the next 50 years!).

What’s the best way for marketers to get in touch?

Best way to get in touch is by emailing contact [at] demandlab.com.

And remember to stay with me this month – new Marketo How Tos are underway.

“Revenue marketing is the strategy that transforms marketing from a cost center to a revenue center.”

This line begins Debbie Qaqish’s latest work, Rise of the Revenue Marketer, a fully developed view of the revenue marketing theme that has exploded in the past five years. Debbie has been one of the key proponents of the idea that marketers can and should own more of the sales funnel, including bringing revenue – real dollars – to the table. Other proponents include Jon Miller at Marketo and the team at Eloqua. In her book, Debbie Qaqish, integrates this concept as a strategic imperative and overall system, which goes beyond marketing automation.

Many of us know Debbie from her numerous presentations at Marketo events and her thought leadership as Chief Strategy Officer at The Pedowitz Group, where she coined the term “revenue marketer” in 2010. Since then, this concept has permeated every aspect of B2B marketing, leading to terms like “revenue performance management” and others.

To paraphrase Jeff Pedowitz, marketing automation providers can only do so much to help marketers. For instance, when I setup Marketo at several firms, it was one thing to implement the software, but it was another to look at the entire revenue process beyond the systems. Fortunately, my team was forward thinking and we had been moving our process to be revenue funnel focused. Still, we lacked some of the key functions and had to rely on the most technical marketer for things that would ideally be done by a marketing operations specialist and a reporting analyst.

In her new book, which launches today, she combines her years of experience in turning B2B marketing teams from the old interruption “cost” methods toward permission based content marketing methods. Methods that tie activity directly to revenue.

If you have been in marketing for a few years, this idea is not new.

What is new?

Strategy. One of my recent worries is ensuring marketing is working on strategic tasks and not just tactical activities. Rise of the Revenue Marketer offers advice on just how to do this as a marketing leader by pulling together teams, processes, change, and executive buy in.

The key question Debbie asks is one she was faced with in 2005, before she went on her own revenue journey:

“What are you going to do about revenue?”

This is a thought-provoking question that I have found myself faced with since joining the world of marketing from a successful sales career. “Revenue? That’s what I worry about in sales!” It took a couple of years to understand what a revenue marketer might be like, and I enjoy taking firms on that journey.

First, you have to understand Debbie’s definition of Revenue Marketing:

1. Sales ready leads for top of the funnel
2. Accelerate opportunities
3. Measures for Repeatable, Predictable, and Scalable revenue in the pipeline and marketing ROMI.
4. Revenue – marketing is becomes a generator, not a cost center.

Getting to this definition within your organization is a goal. The journey is longer. Debbie shows us this journey from

• Traditional Marketing, which includes the 4Ps: product, promotion, placement, and price. Debbie notes that B2B marketers here have little clout and report on activities and cost metrics.
• Lead Generation: this is where I started in my first marketing role. This is a series of tactical activities and metrics, but focused on moving leads to Sales.
• Demand Generation is where “closed loop” systems and marketing automation transform the lead gen process. Marketing becomes responsible for nurturing and lower funnel activities. Revenue metrics begin to appear, including MQLs, SALs, and pipeline contribution.
• Revenue Marketing: this is where you have a “machine that is repeatable, predictable, and scalable (RPS).” Now marketing is responsible for revenue and rewarded for it.

A different view is in this table I created:

Revenue Marketing Stage	Clout	Model	Activities	Metrics	Sales Alignment	Compensation
Traditional	Low	MarCom	Branding	Impressions, Costs, Activities	None	Salary
Lead Gen	Low	Disconnected systems	Events, tactical emails	Costs, Leads, Activities	Maybe	Salary
Demand Gen	Medium	Marketing automation and funnel	Nurturing	Costs, MQLs, SALs, Opps, Revenue	Full	Salary
Revenue Marketing	High		Revenue funnel	ROI, Forecasting Revenue	Synergy	Salary+Bonus for Quota

Developing your marketing organization into a revenue marketing team and making sure the rest of the firm is on board is a long process. Debbie makes no qualms about that. In fact, many of the case study interviewees describe just how long it can take and what that means. Typically this meant a 12-36 month process within marketing, with Sales, and with fellow executives. She describes how to go about achieving buy-in to move from Traditional marketing to Revenue Marketing. It is reassuring to know it takes more than a 90-day plan to transform both marketing and how it works with Sales.

Debbie refers to this process as the RM6 Model. One of the aspects I consider to be critical is People. Having the right combination of skills on the revenue marketing team will ensure success.

Too many marketing automation firms are quick to sell the goal of revenue marketing, while distracting you from the hard reality of getting there. I’ve seen enough small firms use marketing automation that just weren’t ready in terms of Team, Process, Goals, or Executive Sponsorship. Just last week I received a marketing email from a former client and discovered they had switched to HubSpot. I suspect they may switch again when they are disappointed by the results. How do I know this? Their organization was just not ready and it likely still isn’t. Remember, marketing automation is one facet of the journey from Lead Generation to Demand Generation.

How does Rise of the Revenue Marketer compare to other works?

Every single book that discusses this new world of B2B marketing where “marketing has a seat at the revenue table” also mentions how the Buyer Journey has changed. Sales people are now at the tail end of that process, responsible for the close and the people relationships that are still a necessity. Thus, you may find these books repeating themselves, especially in the first two chapters.

• Eloqua’s Digital Body Language by Steve Woods

This was the first new marketing book I read when Steve Woods sent it over to me during my first marketing automation RFP. I found it helpful in better understanding scoring and the tools available. While “digital body language” as a term never really took off, the idea that Sales can benefit from increased visibility into the buyer behavior did. Debbie Qaqish takes a more strategic approach and almost completely ignores the tactical bits of lead scoring. Thus, these two books can work together.

• Marketo CEO Phil Fernandez’s book: Revenue Disruption

To me, this book felt very much like a summary of Marketo’s marketing materials and education pieces that I could get for free. In fact, I did get this book for free at the Marketo Summit 2012 (thanks Liz!). Like Digital Body Language, the book walked through the tactical considerations that are solved by marketing automation. Phil also described the concept of Revenue Performance Management, which ties in nicely with Marketo’s RCA and MFM packages. A nice package for the mid-stage buying process.

• Blogs

I hate to admit this, but a lot of what I learned about B2B marketing since 2008 has come from blogs. Blogs of top marketers, blogs of marketing automation makers, blogs from marketing automation agencies. As I note below, much of the content in Rise of the Revenue Marketer is from Debbie’s previous work. Isn’t that the great thing about the internet now? A student of marketing can learn the latest techniques without an MBA or even a dozen years of experience.

What Could Be Done Better?

As I read the book, I found that it followed the standard business book format:

• Introduce the reader to the concepts.
• Walk through the author’s experience.
• Interrupt the reader with quotes and interviews from executives. I found these almost all helpful and interesting, especially when executives were candid about what it took to move from Traditional Marketing to Revenue Marketing. Several executives admitted they were still in certain stages, which I found refreshing, as most business book case studies are a bit too successful. What I continue to find in all business books is that these quotes and case studies (always in grey boxes) completely interrupt the flow of what the author is saying. I would prefer to place these case studies at the end of the chapter, which still reinforces the concepts.
• Case Studies from large organizations that the author has worked with. Honestly, I would do this too because it is far easier to ask those you know. Another small business startup book I read took a different approach by inviting people to a survey and then asking interesting respondents for a case study interview. I found that technique led to several off beat ideas.
• Chapter Endings to inspire action: these are called “Key Plays” in Rise of the Revenue Marketer. I found these to be helpful action items in developing the road map for the revenue marketing journey.

In some respects, the book is a compendium of the author’s thought leadership, papers, presentations, and blog posts over the years. So regular readers of The Pedowitz Group’s materials will be very familiar with much of the book. While you could read much of that for free, you may find it helpful to have the complete package in one place. This is especially true for aspiring marketing leaders just as it is for a busy marketing executive.

While reading the book, I felt challenged to explore new ways to handle revenue marketing at my company. Debbie does not offer a lot of advice for very small firms, or sales led organizations, or the unique challenges posed by a startup. Perhaps the unwritten assumption is that revenue marketing as a whole can only be fully realized at larger firms. Recently, I have been working to convince my peers to make the leap from Lead Generation to Demand Generation and beyond, but I am unsure how to do this given our unique constraints. Certainly no one has the precise answer, but I would love to hear how Debbie would approach the challenge, as Pedowitz works with small firms too.

Conclusion and Recommendation

Debbie describes her concepts and experiences well while offering helpful examples and frameworks along the way. Rise of the Revenue Marketer is aimed primarily at fellow marketing leaders; however, I find it could be a great read for other executives looking at the latest ways to market their services. In fact, I highly recommend having your Sales VPs and CEO read this book as you begin the socialization process so that they are as excited as you are!

Do I recommend this book for those less familiar with The Pedowitz Group and revenue marketing strategies? Yes, absolutely.

Buy it on Amazon.

Disclosures: I received a preview copy of Rise of the Revenue Marketer. There are no affiliate links!

Stay tuned for a few new Marketo tutorials in the coming weeks.